Interview with TheViper on Age of Empires IV: “To be honest, for it just being released, I feel like it is an incredibly balanced game.”

We had the pleasure of talking to Ørjan “TheViper” Larsen a couple of days after his victory over TheMista at Genesis to talk about everything Age of Empires IV. From balance, to the future of the new installment of the franchise, up to how he personally juggles two games at the same time.

The interview was recorded on November 17 and edited for clarity and brevity.

Game Balance in AoE IV

esports.com: First of all congratulations on the victory at Genesis, that was a great series against TheMista. Before the tournament you put out a Tier List on your YouTube channel that saw Mongols and French on top and at the playoffs we saw that play out quite accurately. Are there any changes you would like to make to your list after all the matches?

TheViper: “I think my ranking is pretty good in the way I put it. The only thing I would maybe do is put Rus one step down. Maybe. But Rus also has a high ceiling and a lot of potential so I would still stand by my current tier list.”

esports.com: Currently the meta is still very much in flux. The first week saw French Knights dominate everything, now we have the Yam Network-fueled Mongols doing work. Where do you expect the meta to develop further?

TheViper: “It’s hard to predict right now. Because right now I think we need the developers to make some changes to the civs. There are still some bugs and some civs that get more or less boosts than they are supposed to. So it is a little bit rough on the balance too.

For example the Holy Roman Empire’s Prelate, that is supposed to give them constant buffs, is not really doing that automatically. So we don’t really get to see the full power of the civs as they were intended to. But I think the meta is a little bit set right now.

While it is still very early days, I don’t think the current balance and the way things are working will change too much. The only thing I might be expecting more of going forward is more walls. Springald use has already kicked up into high gear throughout the tournament and I think that will continue as well. Besides that it will depend a lot on what the devs change going forward.”

Also read: Age of Empires IV Civilizations Tier List – Which are the best?

You already talked a lot about the bugs, that are unfortunately still plaguing the game. Like the HRE prelate bug or the relic exploit with the Rus. If we put those issues aside for now, what balance changes would you like to see to help struggling civilizations such as Dehli, the HRE or the Chinese?

First of all to make weaker civs on water maps better, we need to nerf the French. That would be the first step on water maps. Besides that right now the main issue with for example Delhi, is, that while they have a lot of potential due to the free upgrades, it is hard to recover if you take damage early on. Delhi, Abbasids and Chinese are the only civilizations that don’t have any special unit in the early ages. They only have archers, spearmen and horsemen, while all others have some sort of special unit. So if you fall behind in the early game with those it is a bit difficult.

I’m not sure where exactly I would buff. For Chinese I think it could make sense to reduce the price of the second landmark they can build in each age. Maybe 50% cheaper or something. That will make it easier to get to the next dynasty on the Chinese and accelerate with their bonuses.

For HRE of course fixing the bugs would be nice. I actually started playing HRE a little bit in the last few days and I found a way to play that is quite strong, so I am not sure if they need a buff anymore. It is really hard to say for me what exactly needs to be done to be fixed, because I also want to see how the civs actually play without all the bugs. Then I will get a proper feeling of how good they are.

I’m not sure if they (HRE) need a buff anymore

I also think Chinese and HRE have been put into the bin right from the start as ‘No, they are just bad’. So people did not play them to their full potential. I have had some success against French players and such with those two civs, so I am kind of thinking, that I want to give them another week or so to try them out a bit more and see if they really are bad.

Age of Empires IV’s melting pot and the future direction

Moving further on to more general AoE IV topics. AoE IV has been a large melting pot for a lot of different RTS players. We have plenty of people from WarCraft III, StarCraft II and also from Age of Mythology, Age of Empires III and Age of Empires Online. The game has also brought in many players outside of the RTS genre. What are your thoughts on that? Does AoE IV benefit from it or does it hamper the game?

I would say it is not hampering at all, it is definitely a positive thing. For me it is really cool to see all these people enter this game. It is also an opportunity for someone like me, who is very locked into Age of Empires II, to compete with others. RTS games tend to banter among each other. Fans always talk bad about other games: “This game is harder than this one” and so forth. So it is fun to see people come from all games and try to knock each other down.

LucifroN and VortiX are a great example. When i started watchinh StarCraft in like 2011 or 2012, those two were playing Starcraft. And now I am playing games against them in Age of Empires IV, which is really cool. You see Marinelord coming in as well, all these guys that I have been watching in other games too.

It is fun to see people come from all games and try to knock each other down.

I think this is a way to bring a lot more attention to Age of Empires IV because those players always bring crowds with them so it’s nothing but positive.

A lot of the games we just mentioned require a very different skillset from Age of Empires II or IV. Do you think any game has an edge right now in terms of an inherent better skillset suited to AoE IV?

Skillset-wise I wouldn’t say any game has a particular edge. I don’t think AoE IV is as micro-intensive as StarCraft 2 or Age of Empires II. It focuses more on the macro aspect – strategy and decision making. It’s about positioning your army and making the right moves and developing your base correctly.

If anything maybe a game like StarCraft has a disadvantage because they are usually extremely fast and with a lot of micro involved. In AoE II for example there is a lot of small micromanagement in the economy, which is also not there in AoE IV. I am not too familiar with Age of Mythology, Age of Empires III, Online or the other games. So I can’t say if they have an edge or disadvantage but I think it is quite the even playing field.

Age of Empires IV has released in a time period where people are saying “RTS is dead”. Despite that it has gotten a lot of attention since release. What is AoE IV doing right, that so many people are enjoying it right now?

The pacing of the game is a nice middle ground between people, that are originally AoE II-fans and StarCraft fans. It is a bit slower than StarCraft but still fast enough that they can think it is entertaining. So they hit the sweetspot when it comes to the pacing.

It is also easier to understand and realize what is happening in-game. If a new player comes to StarCraft for example, there are aliens, different creatures and you don’t know what is going on. Compared to AoE IV it helps a lot that you know what you see. This is a guy on a horse, he’s a knight. This guy has a bow, he is an archer. So it’s easier to understand and realize what is actually happening.

The dynamics between all civilizations being unique help too. Although they share some units, it is still very different on how they play out due to their civilization bonuses. I think that also adds to the appeal of the game, at least it is one of the reasons why I find it very interesting.

Now it is on to the devs to keep improving on the quality of life features and all those things to keep the game going in the right direction. If they do that, I think the game has a very bright future.

We have touched multiple times on how the ball is in the developers’ court now. So what do you think needs to be prioritized by them? Do they need to adress balance, bugfixes or quality of life changes first?

I think bugfixes probably need to come first. Especially because they also affect balance. After that I’d say quality of life features. To be honest, for it just being released, I feel like it is an incredibly balanced game. So fix the bugs, get the quality of life features in and then you can think about balance later down the road.

To be honest, for it just being released, I feel like it is an incredibly balanced game.

I would also like to see the ingame ranked mode come into play asap. Because I feel like that is also something, that a lot of people need to scratch that competitive itch. Although there is the hidden ELO and the ladder on the website it doesn’t really compare to an in-game ranked mode.

Juggling two Games at Once

Now moving away from just Age of Empires IV. You are also in the midst of preparation for the Age of Empires II tournament “King of the Desert #4”. How difficult is it for you to juggle two games at the same time. What are the adjustments you need to make?

That process has just begun for me. I have been playing exclusively AoE IV since release.  On Monday, just two days ago, I tried to play AoE II again. It has been over a month since I last played it and the hotkey situation was really awkward. There has been a lot of missclicking and clicking the wrong things and trying to use functions that are in AoE IV but not in AoE II.

So it was awkward but yesterday after a few games I feel like I was in the groove again. Because in the end it’s like riding a bike, I have done this for many many many years, I just got to get into it.

I don’t know how it is going to be going forward. If there are suddenly going to be big tournaments in AoE II and AoE IV somewhat overlapping, it wil be hard to figure out what I should prioritize and how to do it. But for now it has been alright. The transition to AoE II already feels like I am kind of back to normal so it went faster than I anticipated.

So what are the largest difference you needed to adjust for between AoE II and AoE IV?

Hotkeys!

Only the hotkeys?

No (laughs). I guess the biggest thing is the meta being figured out. In AoE II we kind of know what is coming. Although there are like 39 civilizations right now, an insane amount, all civilizations are very similar. There are just small bonuses that differentiate them. So the meta is figured out and for King of the Desert we are only playing one map. Even though there is random map generation, it is still the same map in theory. So at the moment we know what to expect, we know what we should do and try to improve on these things.

We cannot completely surprise someone with a revolutionary tactic or strategy, which you probably can in AoE IV right now.

Moving on to your streaming community a bit. You obviously have a very die-hard AoE II fanbase there. Is there a lot of conflict if you stream AoE IV?

Throughout my life whenever I try to stream something elst than AoE II, the chat is pretty much filled with: “Why not AoE II?” So it is quite brutal. I think a lot of people are a bit more open-minded to AoE IV, because it is the next installment of the franchise. So there is more support or openness towards that, but I still see a lot of comments being thrown around, saying: “You are just paid to play AoE IV, it is so bad.”

All I can say to that is, that it’s fine if you have your own opinion, but there are also so many people, that are supportive and find the game really fun so I don’t see why we can’t just enjoy both games. Why does it have to be a problem?

Why can’t we just enjoy both games?

It gets a little frustrating if you see those comments non-stop, not only in streams but also YouTube comments. While it is annoying, I do understand it as well. People have supported me for years in the other game, so they don’t like it, if i am suddenly playing something different.

Much of that support is of course owed to your stellar success in Age of Empires II, where many consider you the “greatest of all time”. How do you deal with that title and pressure?

I usually like pressure, because it triggers me to perfrom even more. So I do like that feeling. When I enter a tournament and people expect me to do well, it makes me really want to push myself. Or when I enter a tournament and people say “yeah, he’s washed up”. I heard that a couple of times now, but I like that too.

It never really bothered me that a lot of people have expectations of me. I guess I am good at ignoring that, so I don’t think I am really good at answering how to deal with it.

Tips for beginners

Now a final couple of questions to close out the interview. If someone wants to start out in Age of Empires IV without any prior RTS experience, what are the beginner tips you would give him?

Play French (laughs). Actually that is not even joking. You should probably start with French or English as they are the more straightforward and easy civilizations to play.

They will give you an introduction to basic economy management and unit management. In the end it is an RTS game. You build up economy, build up military and then you fight. It is important to take it step by step. Because if you have no experience in RTS it becomes very overwhelming. But it is just about understanding that, yes, the game will  be harder first, but it will get easier as soon as you learn and get these “Ahh”-moments.

And slow and steady you will become a competent RTS gamer.  An when you do that the game is a lot of fun. But it can also be a lot of fun as a casual, so most importantly just have fun.

Also read: Age of Empires IV – How to reach Feudal Age within 5 minutes on all civilizations

Speaking of that constant slow and steady improvement. What is better in terms of improving? Just spamming a fixed build order or is it better to react to the general gamestate?

As someone with plenty of RTS experience, the best way to learn was to just throw myself out there to do everything that came to mind there and then in order to get a feel on how things are working. If you lock yourself in a build, you just become a one-trick-pony. It hampers your development as a player and also your understanding and learning of the game. So definitely adapt and play different things, try out other civilizations.

It is definitely not bad to just play English 10 games in a row and try to make a Ram Push work. That’s fine. But you eventually have to try other things too. Not just to learn for yourself how other civilizationss work, but also to learn how to counter another civilization if you play something else. So there are a lot of benefits in playing different civilizations and strategies.

Thank you very much for the detailled interview and good luck for King of the Desert 4. I am looking forwad to seeing you perform there as well.

Thank you.

Also read:

• Age of Empires IV shows roadmap featuring Ranked Seasons, user generated content and more
• TheViper wins first Age of Empires 4 tournament GENESIS

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